Bob Weir gave an interview on KBCO in Denver, and the subject came up:
Listen to it here. It’s a little jerky, with pieces missing, but I transcribed some of it…
We had to cover our asses. What they’re doing is illegal, unless there are arrangements made… particularly in the case of covers – other people’s material.
If we’re perceived to be distributing their songs without their agreenent, they have every right, and really and every obligation, to sue us…
We had to take it down. We had no choice. It’s archive.com’s [sic] job to make arrangements with the other people whose material… we’re playing, and then everything’s good….
Probably a lot of it is stuff that we intend to release in the future anyway.
We need revenue. Our music division needs revnue so we can digitize all of that stuff.
The ‘information wants to be free, man’ – those folks… this is not information, this is music. It’s kind of value-added information. Some people prefer to call it art….
We had to go ahead and do the right thing, and it upset some folks. I’m really sorry about that. So they started up a petition, a boycott, and all that kind of stuff. I really hope they can stick to their guns, and boycott us, and… seeya….
Weir’s attitude makes me very sad. The publishing/rights issue has been the big unspoken question mark in this whole archive.org deal for quite some time, but coming from Weir in this interview it sounds like legalistic bullshit retrofitted by some bureaucrat.
And really shitty PR, too. Bob’s been a pretty classy character through most of the sturm und drang of the post-Garcia GD drama, and to hear him sneering at fans is pretty distressing. Ratdog’s (and GDP’s) publicist, Dennis McNally, is usually on the road w/ Ratdog – was he there in the studio when Bob blew off a big chunk of his audience?
Sure, some of the most vocal of the complainers in this deal are totally full of themselves, and I thought the boycott petition was a lousy way to seek redress of grievances, but jeez, Bobby.
P.S.The other voice (aside from Weir and the interviewer) heard on the KBCO interview is Mark Karan’s.
Yes, it makes me sad to but I have to say that initially, it made me sick to my stomach. I have spent my last dime on Ratdog. Never again. Sorry Jerry. And I will go to Gathering next year whether he is there or not but I can say with confidence that I will not be standing in the rain on that field to watch.
Peace…………..
Thanks so much for posting this.
It seems like if there were such a risk of being sued by artists that the Dead cover, they would’ve had a more conservative policy regarding taping/trading from the beginning. Not to mention that if this were the case, then they wouldn’t be able to offer streams of the soundboards or downloads of that audience recordings.
I wish they would just nut up and acknowledge that this move was so that they can sell downloads. I can understand that they want to prosper from their work, I just wish they’d be a little more respectful to their fans.
I agree the boycott petition was a lousy way to to seek redress of grievences but I signed it to find out the truth – and now I did. Am I happy I did – No. I am very sad it had to come down to this. But information needs to be free!
I am finding my peace about the removal of the SBD’s from the archive…. and then I heard this. Has it gone this far. Bobby and his friend were *laughing* the whole time at how ridiculous his fans are, and if they’re gone, “see ya.” So, so sad. I don’t feel mad at Bobby, just sad about the whole thing. It’s the end of an era.
we’re all entitled to our moods which pass like dirt. feelin a bit blue myself. having listened to the Grateful Dead Hour over three decades which isnt subject to modern problems, on a hot crazy night, theres something indescribable knowing your thinking the same thought at the same time as all the other weirdos in your region.
(i wanna live forever)
Bobby’s comments were about the worst thing he could have said at this time. Way to kiss 40 years of good will goodbye.
The whole afair has been handled so poorly by GDP.McNally has lost the most in my eyes.He made so many untrue statements I really though I was listening to some Bush officials.Sad.
Grateful Dead/Archive.org Brouhaha Roundup
If you haven’t heard the news, it seems that there’s been a partial reversal of GDM’s (Grateful Dead Merchandising) decision to pull all of the live Grateful Dead concert recordings that had been posted at archive.org’s Live Mu…
I just want to thank David Gans personally for keeping us informed and for being objective and fair-minded.
Being a dinosaur,I have never downloaded any concerts for free, and really enjoy the AUD tapes, so I have no personal stake in the Archives decision.
However, I am deeply saddened and dissapointed by the BS coming from GDM and Bobby. While the music will always remain unrivaled, my memories and feelings for the Band (other than JG) have forever been tarnished.
Hmmm, interesting point Bob makes about legality of covers. I am not a lawyer, but it would seem to me that many of the bands on LMA also do covers and would have similar concerns (if they are real). I know for a fact that you will likely find nearly as many covers for any String Cheese concert as you do for a Dead one.
Give Bobby a break, yeah it all sucks but I wonder how he felt seeing all the ingrates who signed the effin petition, nice way to say thanks for all the good years. The fault and greed in my eyes is to all those who signed.
The point I got out of all this is the precedent the Dead set for the new groovy bands that allow taping, etc, if it was not for the Grateful Dead, non of this would have existed.
think I’ll see when Ratdog is playing and buy some tickets!
peace
tim
David, I see you want it both ways…
You are allowed to reply incredulously to the fans’ “protests” like you did last week, but if Bobby does it, he’s “classless”?
Is it possible that he is extremely hurt by all the negagtive remarks by the fans, strangers he has sweated and exhausted himself to entertain forty years? What gives with the double standard?
we need revenue!!!!
I’ve seen my last Ratdog show for sure.
We Need Jerry!!!!!!
It is kinda funny when Bobby does his George W impersonation, but he says a lot of stuff that’s totally true. The emotional stuff about the fans was unneccesary, but I have witnessed the kind of pressure he is often under. But the legal issues are long-standing, and just smoldering to raise up some other time. Years ago, in the early days of the AOL GD Forum, we had trouble simply allowing people to post trading lists. One of the big bugaboos back then was worrying about being sued by the songwriters. Anyone who’s paid attention to Chuch Berry, for example, knows he can be a real stickler about this sort of thing. Bobby’s always had a dry caustic sense of humor, so I’m not that surprised here. This certainly has been a strange time.
Oh my God!!! Is Bob serious?!?! “I hope they (Dead Heads) stick to their guns and boycott us.” “See ya’!” WHAT is that all about?!?! I am not one to take the time to put my thoughts in writing, I am more of a verbal kind of guy. Maybe because I am lazy and have other things to do or maybe its fear of having to get into a debate that I am not interested in partaking in. But I have to let my $.02 be known.
It sounds to me that he is taken direction from someone with a business mind. Not that this is not good. It actually is the right thing to do when your not a good business person and hire someone to make business decisions on your behalf. But to tell the world that they had to do “what was the right thing to do” for fear of being sued by the artists that are covered? What is the difference of us trading audience tapes for 30 years plus???? They did not have this fear before and now they do? Please Mr. Dylan.. Keep your lawyers at bay.
Please NOTE: Bob said that the board tapes will be released in the future. Come on Bob! I love you man but at the end of the day its about making the decision to create revenue and sell what is rightfully yours! Don’t sugar coat it with some lame ass excuse. You want to sell your product then sell it.
On a personal note: I have been trading Grateful Dead and all band members solo material for over 25 years. I have owned one of the largest collections of music from most people I know. It’s funny how I still own all the vinyl releases, cassette releases, and CD, SACD, DVD-A, and DVD-V, go to most shows within a 500 mile radius including Ratdog and Phil ect….
I hope Bob remembers that he is such an important person in so many different peoples lives! Without him their would not have been the Grateful Dead as we know it and we are blessed that he was part of that magic. I only hope that he understands and thinks about what his decisions will bring to not just him the GD org but to the many souls he has touched.
Please do the right thing folks!
With Peace and Light; Happy Holidays
Joe Antinucci
Rhode Island
Wow, I am glad to see that I’m not the only one that thought Mr Weirs statements were JUST PLAIN NASTY! I don’t care if the music is on Archives or not because I know it will be available some place or another [although it was fun]. What makes me angry is the way he came off. I always thought HE thought he was the leader of the band but WE KNOW DIFFERENT! Thank you Jerry, Phil, Bill and Micky for making it all possible. As for Mr Weir if I could show a picture of me sticking out my tongue it would be right here { }…peace..addie
I’m sorry guys. I am also a bit sad about the whole argument thing, but it was these guys in the end who really started everything and they might be a bit frustrated. Okay. Big deal? I have hundreds of audience recordings and the trading will still carry on. We should all be thankful for everything they’ve already given us. I must also see I do not quite dig the “I want this, I’m entitled to it…” attitude. I mean “why”? “How come”? That leads to enough trouble in our world… Entitled to free fuel? Okay, bomb Irak…? The world is made a better place by good deeds. Not by people dissing each other. I think I’d feel rather pissed off by not all but a good amount of people in Bobby’s situation. And no, I did not sign the petition. I thought it was rather nasty. And consider this. I wrote to Mark Karan’s site when the FREE d/l on his site didn’t work and Mark Karan and Maile actually sent me a hard copy CD to Europe for FREE! Now really. Those guys may be being a bit tough at the moment but they’re still some of the best around in my opinion.
Hey not the best of situations and not exactly following along with their legacy, but come on! I would not, and alot of you would not, be the type of person I am today and have had the joys and gifts that GD helped lead me to. i also would not be the fan I am was it not for my older brother giving me his tape collection or an older buddy getting me started with some prime tapes. It was that sense of community and sharing that has led us to this point in our fandom. Shit, how many bands have ever let audiences record their shows, much less set aside a prime spot for them to do so. One of the topics that I have picked up on is those saying how groundbreaking this practice was and how many of these bands that we freely listen to today may have never adopted that model or may not have been around to have adopt it!
Archive.org, as it pertains to GD downloads, is great (especially for the old stuff) but was almost too easy. Is easy web-access to the music the best way to further and grow this community that we have all worked so hard to with…Or is a return to the roots of tape trading mixed with some on-line downloads the best way? I don’t have the exact answer, maybe that is what we shoudl be discussing.
But in the end the music is there and if to get it we have to reconnect in the process…so be it…
Peace Everybody!
Get off of Weir’s butt.If it wasn’t for him and the DEAD what would we even listen to when we’re trying to unwind or just relax a bit.Tell me when is the last time you went on a road trip and took 20 U2 tapes to listen to? Or anyone else for that matter.For the last 20 years my favorite pastime has been to strap on my walkman and get on my bike and hit the road for a long trip. It’s that music that gets me up the hills and motivates me along the way. Weir-anytime you want to come to Roanoke Va and enjoy the mountains hiking or biking call me-540.387.6078 ext 478-this place is heaven for that type of activity.What a long strange trip it continues to be. Thanks Bob-Don Reid Roanoke Virginia
I really hope they can stick to their guns, and boycott us, and… seeya….
Yep. See ya.
Joe Antunucci posting at a Dead site? Imagine that!
Anyway, I think people are missing an important point about all this with comments about lawyers not going after traders (or something like that).
Logistics plain and simple.
Anyone think they can make an accurate guess as to how many people have traded and/or downloaded through these many years?
Of course you/we/I can’t. For that reason we are safe.
Not so for the Dead’s organization. In the terms we are speaking about they are probably about the biggest target out there.
So, myself, I don’t doubt Weir’s story. It’s a shame he came off the way he did and even sadder the reaction it elicited.
In terms of value the Dead have given us over the years, I’d say the balance is definately in our favor.
Hell, the spiritual lift we all got from one good show was well worth all the money we have each spent on tickets, records/tapes/CD/DVD’s, t-shirts etc., don’t you think?
That being said, I will continue to gladly shell out a few bucks now and then for a few hours in heaven if that’s what it takes.
Life sometimes requires pragmatic solutions and I think that is what the case is here. Better to pay for the ride and have it continue than for it to stop altogether.
We can’t get a miracle ticket every night nor should we expect the same for downloads.
All things must pass….
Roger in Florida
PS–Joe, if you are reading this, I used to work at APC in RI while you were still there, thus the smart-ass comment at the beginning.
Hope all is well.